Posted by The_Meehan on May 14, 2002 at 22:32:14:
In Reply to: Re: Hunters and Supernatural Friends posted by The Goat on May 14, 2002 at 06:26:04:
: > Actually, I *think* the problem is just the reverse - the average Hunter player leans farther to Mercy than is expected or desired,
: Expected or desired by who?
By the game designers/authors/editors.
: I am the Consumer.
Yep. And they are the Creators/Artists. Both points of view are equally valid when playing the game. But if the views diverge, the Creators can either act to preserve *their* vision, adopt the *consumer's* vision, or find some synthesis of the two. All I'm pointing out, really, is that based on *my* understanding of the game, the views *have* diverged, and the first option appears to have been chosen. Or maybe the third, I'm not sure.
: Without me, and all the other Consumers, H:tR is a cool game played by a handful of people in someone's dining room.
Huh? You mean it's more than that now? ;)
: I thought, upon looking at the game, that Mercy was half the gig.
No, it's about a third. Depending on how much wait you give the Lost Creeds, the Mercy creeds are anywhere from 1/3 to 3/7 of the game. Of cource, we don't know what the relative numbers of Imbuings are, what the percentage breakdown of the various creed numbers are.
: I thought, with creeds like Redeemer and Innocent and Judge that violence wasn't going to be the best answer..that the totally unrealistic idea that the Zealous would cleanse the earth wasn't the point of the game. I was under the impression that alliences could be made with some Afflicted.
Your prejudices are showing here. *Sometimes* violence is the *ONLY* answer, and *sometimes* it's the best of the alternative options. In normal day-to-day life, either in the WoD or here in RL, neither are likely to be the case, but the life of a Hunter is NOT normal, anymore, and it brings new meaning to day-to-day. For the Hunters, violence is probably always an ever-present option.
As for the Zealots; have you read the game ad copy? "Inheirit The Earth", "Take Back The Night", "You are the Reckoning" - these are *not* armchair activist slogans. Going through my collection, the back cover copy statistics stand like this :
Call to violence (7/18) - HSH, HSG, HPG, HbJ, HbA, HtN, HbW;
Call to action (4/18) - tWD, HbD, HbM, HtR;
Statements of horror (2/18) - HbH, HHW;
Neutral (3/18) - HFC, HbV, HSC;
Peace overtures (2/18) - HbI, HbR;
Please note the overwhelming preponderance of the "Call to Violence/Action" categories; also note that they include a strong majority (6/9) of the non-creed supplements (including HtR itself). Also, and I'm being flippant here, the name of the game is "Hunter: The Reckoning" not "Comforter: The Cuddling".
As for alliances - you've got your dander up; I've never said alliances or friendships were impossible between Hunters and Monsters, just that overall, such are *overwhelmlingly* likely to be short-term alliances of convience. The *problem* I have with the way *most* people play these alliances is that they are almost the exact opposite.
: If the game designers didn't intend for Hunter to be this way, they should have left out the Mercy and Vision creeds and opted to make a video game instead.
What they *wanted* I think weren't gun-bunnies that go "Bang-pow!" at the drop of a hat, but activist Imbued who strive to "take back the night" from the Hunters, who strive to weaken (ideally, eliminate) the Monsters hold and influence on the WoD. Ken Cliffe, Ed Hall, and others have said (in print even) that they wish there was less gun-bunny art in the early game lines, and that recent art has been close to what they want. They haven't let up on the theme however - the "Call to Action" is *still* a huge part of the game.
: So, we didn't play the game the way they wanted us to, so they have to rewrite the game now?
No, they *aren't* rewriting the game, they're *trying* to preserve their original vision. IMO, of course.
: I don't think there's anything wrong with Hunter as it is. I don't think that the tendency to select a creed from the Mericful side of things has anything to do with the way the game is written. Instead, I think this reflects the choices and tendencies of the Consumers.
Yep. Agreed there. In fact, thinking deeper about it, I wonder if there aren't two counter-vailing trends. I imagine that for the TT segement, there's a strong tendency to the standard munchkin gun-bunny violence. However, online - or more specifically here on Hunter.List - the tendency is the exact opposite. Honestly, Lex, if we ran the "What do you play?" poll now, I'd expect that the Mercy creeds have a very strong showing. Or maybe people are just (IMO) playing the Zealots poorly.
: I, for one, when playing Hunter, do not like playing homicidal maniacs. Nor do I enjoy playing divine judges or would be super heroes. I find it much more enjoyable to play someone who's solution isn't zeal based.
That's fine. If it hasn't been apparent by now, I, personally, prefer (and find more enjoyable) the